I Haven't Given Up

[mffpetergriffin]

Hello again folks! I have spent the last while learning how to use Radiant. I haven't done any scripting (other than a custom load screen which isn't working out yet) so this is all with Radiant. I haven't compiled and viewed my map for awhile because it was getting big. I just compiled it over night and looked at it this morning and I have the hall of mirrors all over the place. I think it's just because the thing is so big and I don't know the tricks to make it load well in game. If anyone can take a look, I've included the .map, .bsp, and .min (just for fun:)), I would really appreciate it.
Thanks a lot!!
PeterGriffin

http://www.mediafire.com/?lzjkumwtb0x

[jv_map]

That sounds like you have given up

[mffpetergriffin]

No way, I haven't given up! I hadn't posted anything for a long time and I was posting regularly with all kinds of problems so I was just saying I'm still here and still trying. The map just looks like there are caulk textures all over on interior walls and other places.

The map is a big house basically but I don't know tricks like area portals that would help the FPS. I looked up area portals but it said you can't do them on areas that are not completely sealed in or that have entities and that eliminates most of my map.

When I compiled, I got a max winding error and I think I might know why but I don't know for sure. Would that effect the entir map and make it not compile right or something? I'm sure some of you guys could take a look at the map in game and be able to tell right away what is wrong; you're all good like that

[jv_map]

Yes the max points on winding is almost always the cause of very serious visual artifacts all throughout the map. The error itself is most often caused by excessive use of brush T-junctions (which are bad on their own because they often cause visual 'sparkling' along brush edges). Most likely, the offending brush is either a long ladder or long railing brush. Cut it in two or more to fix the problem

[mffpetergriffin]

I don't know exactly what is causing the max winding thing so is there a way to pinpoint it? Does mitering corners help or is that still considered a T-junction?

I made a little landscape pool, two actually, but I compiled after the first and it was fine. I saw in another thread that if a brush has more than 64 corners or something or too many around one axis that the winding thing occurs. I am thinking this might be it but I don't know.

Also, what is the best way to split a brush that might be too big or too long?

[PKM]

for max winding....almost always is a tall ladder built with a ton of rungs and two very tall brushes on the sides . break up a ladder into sections . also can just be a huge/long brush being touched by a lot of other smaller brushes . rule of thumb to me is break up any brush longer than 512 into two or more smaller brushes . i attempted to run in your map but ran into numerous problems, the least of which was brushes disappearing along the walls of the inital startpoint, giving that 'eternal kill the fps by dragging whatever image you last looked at' view (also known as 'forgot to texture a skybox brush . also noticed that again you're using skybox textures within the skybox (along rim of outside balcony) . i don't know what effect you're going for but you shouldn't do that .

in the end though, i saw a vast improvement over your last .map . for the record, don't worry about using vis to boost fps yet, get map making down a little more . plus the size of the map you're building (at this time and with your experience) shouldn't require the use of hints/vis .

[Imagination]

Unfortunatley I cant view your map cos of constant fu#king problems with bas#ard Vista which doesn't allow me to map or play this game.
(you may guess I'm not a big Vista fan atm)
However the info given is correct regarding max points on winding, by reading the replies and that it is a large house is it possible that you have many stairs touching the same brush? if so like the others advised a simple cut in the brush or 2 will irradicate the problems of the max winding and 'hall of mirrors'.
As for optimizing your map I would listen to PKM and not concern yourself until:
1/ You have resolved current errors.
2/ You run into unplayable fps.
When you do solve your problems then within a house it should be very straightforward to portal.

Oh nearly forgot...The simplest way to split a brush is to (if I recall) select the brush press X then click twice along the grid that you want the cut, hold down the shift button and hit enter - this will keep both portions of the brush.
Maybe a screenshot of the problem area(s) will help solve your troubles.
Good luck.
P.S
Hi j.v hope you are well and puting that talented brain to good use!

[neillomax]

I looked at your map. I'm not gong to texture it and compile it but I will tell you to learn how to make a proper skybox instead of that great big box you have your "map" in. That'll kill you every time.

[Devil_Dog]

By T junction, you mean one brush extends into another, yes?
(the bottom part of the T extends into the top as oposed to butting up to it)

I didn't download the map, but also check to be sure there isn't duplicates of all the brushes, like if you loaded the map in Radient ontop of itself.
(I did this a few times before when I didn't like a new feature and wanted to go back. Learned real quick to click "new" then "open")

[mffpetergriffin]

Thanks for all the input. I will try to fix some stuff tonight and recompile. I will try to respond to some of the stuff mentioned.
1. I don't have any long ladders and I know all of mine are good because I haven't changed them since my last successful compilation.
2. Skybox textures appear okay in Radiant despite the fact that my skybox is HUGE. Neil, if you suggest I learn how to make a good skybox and say you will tell me, how about you actually provide some CONSTRUCTIVE criticism and not tell me what I don't know. By saying "map" implies to me you are arrogant but I won't judge you because I don't know you.
3. VIS/Hints - I haven't looked into much because every time I have I get confused. I just didn't know if there was something I should be doing that I am not.
4. Other problems you found PKM: There are a lot of things that aren't right in this compilation that were okay in the last one so I am assuming the new problems are now affecting other things that previously worked (i.e. certain lighting)
5. I knew about the cutting tool thing where you leave both parts but I think I did it on accident so thank you for telling me that.

Thanks again!

[neillomax]

Your skybox IS too big and you need to learn how to make a proper one, IS constructive criticism. "map" means everything inside that humongous skybox that is playable area. Having a skybox that large cuts down on the performance of your map. So does poor layout. Time comes for you to try and use vis to make that map get more that 29 fps, you'll find it almost impossible to use it. More constructive criticism !!!

[mffpetergriffin]

Everything I have seen says to make a hollowed out box around the map. Enlighten me.

[Devil_Dog]

I think he means the sky box is too big, try makeing it from multible sky brushes, like the big walls.

Thats what I gathered anyway.

[mffpetergriffin]

I realize and acknowledge that it is too big, but since he kept saying make a proper one I thought there was a better way to make a skybox rather than just making the one I have into more brushes.

[neillomax]

Everything I have seen says to make a hollowed out box around the map. Enlighten me.

Seek out the source maps for medal of honor. Load them in radiant and see how they were made. You can gain a lot by picking them apart or just by looking.

You can see how they use clips, vis, triggers, etc. The maps layout to take advantage of vis also.

I think the people that say to "just make a box around" are saying that to just get people started.

http://medalofhonor.filefront.com/file/ ... Maps;38867