What makes a map good to a player?

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:59 pm

Lets face it: we want people to play our maps and then play them again and again because they are so fun/balanced/visually stimulating/complex/sexy and so on into eternity...

Am I right or am I wrong? ( I'm assuming I'm right here as usual

)

So when the making of my first map ( dm/vemork_factory ) is now nearing an end, I start to ponder my next map. What does players like in a map?

The things my clan found is this ( regarding the EA maps ):
V2 is the best of the maps, it runs 70% of the time on our servers.
The hunt is to unbalanced, as the axis start to far ahead and can nade the living daylights out of the Allied. Otherwise it is fun.
The bridge is more balanced, but someting about it makes it less fun than V2...
Omaha I will not speak of this map...

This is of course public I'm talking about here, in a clan match the use of tactics and communication mostly overcomes the flaws in the map.

So again: What does the players want? Big battlefields? Cramped labyrinth bunkers? Respawn? Small maps? Huge maps? Cute maps? What, in the name of Jebus do U WANT? WHAT

Ace of Spades · Post by **Ace of Spades** » Thu Feb 13, 2003 11:57 pm

Well, for starters, we all wish we had the secret ingredient in our maps that puts us over the edge so others will enjoy them. I make maps first, because I want to learn something different. Second because I want to have a map that others enjoy playing. When I was just playing the game, I had all kinds of ideas in my head that I would have liked to see in a map. Then, when I started mapping, they all went BYE BYE. It's weird, I don't know if the population of mappers has this happen to them but I'm finding it hard to come up with new ideas for maps or what would make them interesting. Is it just me? Maybe I'm concentrating on learning the mapping thing that I lose focus on what I really wanted to make in a map. I look at the maps that I like, then try to come up with similar ideas with a different twist. Lord knows we don't want another Omaha beach because we are tired of the AXIS having the edge the whole game unless we can storm the beach with enough troops! I personally like Omaha, just 'cuz it's a challange but would like more ballanced maps myself. Hmm.....been rambling on but not sure I answered your question, huh? Well, if I gave all my ideas to you, then I wouldn't have ideas for myself. Be individual when it comes to your map making adventures. I think that when we all have our different twists to the maps we make and draw from the wonderful experience we get from the .MAP server moderators, we can make some really cool maps! Here's what I've done to pacify myself until I come up with some really good maps for us to make. I like movies! I'm currently making some maps that are derived from the Lord of the Rings. Very difficult because there are so many angles. I have other ideas, just not sure how they fit into the MOHAA game. Anyway, now that I've wasted all your time and have rambled on for too long, I hope that an idea has popped into your head. If not, well, hmm......watch some war movies!

Ace

8)

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 12:33 am

He he he, I have no trouble in sharing the map idea I have for my next map: A naval gun battery is assaulted by the Allies, but unlike Omaha there is no respawn and the allied respawn points are closer to the bunkers ( more like V2 ). There should be one or 2 BIG cannons to blow up, and a static torpedo battery some floors down... basically indoor fighting with lots of angles...

But to get basic ideas there are vast resources on the Internte for the history of WW2. I got the idea for The Rjukan project because I was looking for Norwegian military operations during WW2. So browse around for inspiration!

But when you play a map, what makes you like it / dislike it?

Ace of Spades · Post by **Ace of Spades** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 2:46 am

Ok, ok, ok. (Joe Pesci style). I like different ideas, i don't like to see the same old map with the same textures you see everywhere else. There are too many maps these days with just the ordinary buildings. I like the maps that change things up and I don't like the boring square rooms that don't have differences in elevations. Some of my fav. maps are ANUBIS, Eye of the Needle, Close combat, the farm, dasboot, Grabstatte, etc. What is it that I like about them? They're different than the maps you see in MOH, for the most part. I like change. Even something a little "out there" if i may. Using new textures and using the functions to do different things than what we are used to seeing. Like making hatches instead of doors. Teleports that work really cool. Someone here made a map like Stargate! I find that very cool! New and inviting! Not the same old ho hum map that we've all seen. I just don't have any GREAT ideas. Maybe you can come up with some. Is this more helpful than my first reply? Sorry so long. Have a good one!

Ace

Ace of Spades · Post by **Ace of Spades** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 2:49 am

Oh, hey! Was just playing online before that last reply and I asked the question you did, "What would you like to see in a map?" and someone replied, Close quarters, not such a big map. Spending too much time wandering around looking for people to shoot! Just thought that you might like to know what someone else said, 'cuz i'm just here to help and to get it, Also! Talk to ya later!

Ace

Gen Cobra · Post by **Gen Cobra** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 6:55 am

It's not just graphics that cause a player to want to play. The theme is important also, but I think the reason a player plays a map is because that person sees something in the map that interests them. i.e. great places to hide, or an objective that is stimulating to achieve. Most people play a new map because the theme is either strange or is something they have been loking for.

I try and balance my levels with large open areas and a good amount of close quarters. I try and make the spawn points so that no one is whooping each others asses by sniping the hell out of them before they even get a chance to play. People are turned off by that BIG TIME. So watch how ignorant you make your map, you might just end up playing it alone.

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 11:12 am

Hmmm... I'm growing an idea here

We all have one or two original ideas, they may not be complee maps but maby a cool detail. Why dont we set up an open source project ( maby at SourceForge? ) and start a project where all members have access to the source code?

Is this done regularly? Or are we all paranoid hermits sitting at home on our ideas, trying to make the best map in the world, and mostly failing?

Maby take tha .map community to a new level?

rOger · Post by **rOger** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 11:28 am

What would the difference be compared to this forum and the tutorials here if it's just meant for sharing of scripts, prefabs and such.

If you are suggesting a work on a MOD or on a specific map idea there is still the need for a ?berboss to decide the general map design. But if you, or somebody else wish to shoulder that role, I'm more than happy to contribute in doing a part of the map.

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 1:01 pm

Well, the idea is: Put together a group of .map loonies ( or any loonies for that matter ), have a brainstorm for a general map idea ( here on .map perhaps, as many people as possible ), generally I would not like to have a "leader" per se, but somone always takes more or less responsibility. I would like to be able to say: "I dont have time for this right now" leave active duty and come back after a week without the project dying. Anyone should be able to add their ideas and code... all open, no hidden stuff... we would learn HEAPS of stuff

This forum has all that we need for communication: messaging and voting...

And maby the lads ( lasses? ) at .map would like it and support it as a "Tutorial project" ?

/Bjarne

Post by **jv_map** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 1:55 pm

It sounds like a very interesting revolutionary idea

.

However, I have my doubts about the possibility of having multiple mappers work on one map

. That's what you want - right?

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 2:14 pm

Yes jv_map, that is what i want.

But I guess the nature of the map file format makes it nessesary to have an "assembler" that does the actual compiling and inserts prefabs recieved from the mappers into the map file.

Maby like this:
- The latest map file is always published by the "assembler" as soon as an update has been done.
- The mappers download the latest map file and take on parts of the map ( like I'll do this house, you do that bridge ) and send them to the "assembler" as prefabs.

I think the key ingredient here is communication, if the mappers dont talk to each other, I don't think there are any benefits in starting such a pjoject...

mohaa_rox · Post by **mohaa_rox** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 2:46 pm

Ace, try not to use blue color. Makes it hard to see.

Gen Cobra · Post by **Gen Cobra** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 4:38 pm

I think that multiple mappers would have to be rather orginized, but it could, most certianly, be done. Communication would be a must, and everybody would have to agree on a "main theme" of some sort. My theme for my next map is Burning Town. (that one is obvious)

Ace of Spades · Post by **Ace of Spades** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 4:46 pm

Sorry Rox! Didn't know it was hard to read. I was trying to use a cooler color for the eyes. Oops!

Is this color better? I'm just thinking about ya'll.

He he.......

Ace

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Fri Feb 14, 2003 4:51 pm

Thanx Ace

White is best, but if you HAVE TO use color, the new blue is WAY better!