vis design question

M&M · Post by **M&M** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:16 am

i want 2 make the vis design better on my map ,but there is a problem (other than that im not a very good vis designer).
my map has an underground area and an overground area.how do i make my vis design such that the engine doesnt draw underground when im up or vice versa.

more info:there are 5 entry points between over and under which are scattered all over the map.

i would love any help on how i should make it
tnx 4 ur replies in afvance

Jack Ruby · Post by **Jack Ruby** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:40 am

M, bjarne has a great tute for leafgroups on his site, its a simple thing, I will give a quick tute here, though keep in mind this is only 2 leafgroups and in reality you can use as many as you like.

Create a big brush that covers the above ground area, give it the vis texture, right click it, go vis/leafgroup. Do the same for the underground area, then select the above ground leafgroup brush then select the below ground vis brush and hit CTRL K, you should get a blue arrow joining the brushes, now you need to do the same from the below ground brush to the above ground brush.

If thats goes to plan when your character is inside the above ground leafgroup it wont draw the below ground one, takes a little playing around to get it right but basically thats all you need to do

M&M · Post by **M&M** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 1:59 am

i guess i forgot 2 say that the upper area has 2 much stuff on it.
doing that would give the effect i want (sealing underground from over) but it would make another problem
all stuff abouve the ground wil be drawn from anywhere over the ground.
in my map i dont have a single closed room overground and alot of brushes ,debris ,towers and models ........ .or am i wrong?
thats the reason i posted here cause i didnt know how 2 implement manvis on it

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 10:47 am

VIS design starts with map design. From your description I'm getting the feeling that you can see anu place of the map as a player ( in the overground part ). And if so there is really not a lot to do, as you cant VIS out stuff that is actually visible to the player ( well you CAN but it will look like crap ). Ar for general VIS tips, take a look at the tutorial Jack mentioned: http://www.planetmedalofhonor.com/rjuka ... group.html

Jack Ruby · Post by **Jack Ruby** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 11:50 am

Hmmm, well it seems you do have a problem there.

With big open maps the only way I have found to really help with your fps is to use a combination of farplane( fog) and leafgroups, yes we would all love to be able to snipe from a mile away but for our purposes its not really possible as maps get laggy when you can see so many structures. If you get it right the fog will not hinder the players too much, its all a compromise, you just have to play around until you find a farplane setting you can live with

If your farplane is say 3000 you can make leafgroups that match the farplane, so anything over 3000 units away from you will not be drawn, its possible to do, may take a while to get it going though.

tltrude · Post by **tltrude** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 12:21 pm

The basic rule is, when you stand in a vis_leafgroup, the vis_leafgroups it targets can not be visible. So, you can put them underground, just not near the exits. The ones underground can then target the one (or more) above. The underground ones can also target eachother, if one is not visible form the other.

Key: target
Value: outside_vis tunnel1_vis tunnel3_vis

M&M · Post by **M&M** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 7:55 pm

well ,i did read this tut b4.and another one at manstiens as well.thats how i based my vis design (some of it).but my map is an outdoor map ,so practically there isnt any rooms or walls that effectively block the players sight (yeah i know its rather dumb).this has been my 1st map and when i started with it i didnt know that vis design existed so practically it wasnt designed 4 fps ,however since its a rather small map there isnt much fps drop.but ofcourse if i can make it better y not?

the outdoor part (overground) has 2 towers made of a lot of brushes (2 give a realistic look) .it also has alot of other stuff if i put a vis leafgroup on all of the outdoor area and make it not c the underground areas that arent visible then the engine wont draw the underground areas until i come 2 one of the entry points (which is exactly what i want 4 the underground part).but since its called MANual VISibility i think it overrides the default vis design (am i wrong?)making the engine draw all the upper area from anywhere on the upperground. i said that the upperarea doesnt have any effective player visibility blocking but it has a few obstacles,walls and destroyed rooms here and there which all get drawn also despite not being seen from a certain location which is blocked by a small wal 4 example..i also dont want 2 add lots of fog which could spoil the atmosphere ,i already added some and the map looks just fine (i fi dont find a solution i might increase it

).its only when i type r_showtris 2 is when i get shocked from the white screen i get

(only from certain areas).if im 2 implement vis leafgroups 2 an outdoor area ill have 2 make hundreds of them so they look normal,isnt there an easier way that im not thinking of or dont know yet

i hope im makin sense here cause no1 has understood exactly all of what i mean till now.

tltrude · Post by **tltrude** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 10:26 pm

No, the normal vis is still done in the vis compile. Manvis is just helping to block off things it didn't figure out on its own. Adding vis_leafgroups to your map, adds to the visdata and there is a limit of around 2,090,000,000 (2.09Mb) for visdata. So, adding hundreds of vis brushes is not a good idea.

Post by **Bjarne BZR** » Sat Mar 06, 2004 11:55 pm

M&M: what FPS do you get? If you get good FPS thare is no need for man vis at all.... anything above 60-70 is just luxury.

M&M · Post by **M&M** » Sun Mar 07, 2004 11:23 pm

my fps was like 50 on low details,but that was because i had a leak in my map (the upper sky not there) 2 speed the compile process.but after trying a full compile and closing the leak an hour ago.this maps rocked minimum fps ive seen is 80 on high detail

(its rather small)

tnx 4 ur help every1.im adding in the final touches and soon it will be available at the new releases forum (yay)